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Socialism etc. - HSN forum - Page 8

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Socialism etc.


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#141 Dave

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 01:57 PM

oh and why his moral fabric better than me eh

we are saying the same things

maybe its just because i am now getting frustrateed after the last 3-4 months going over the same ground with ermdev

Blair didnt misled anyone he was telling people the facts as me was told them. What would anyother leader have done. As you go into school and you see new computers and new desks and new systems to increase late coming and increase results they are all Labour policys in action. The reason the NHS is still free at point of use is because of Labour. The economy in UK as a whole is strong. It was Blair that gave us a devolved government even after we voted against it the first time around.

As for his middle class policys well maybe that why i am for him. Yet, i dont really totally agree because he taxs the middle class to hell and back again

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#142 bred

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:17 PM

QUOTE(Dave @ May 14 2005, 02:57 PM)
oh and why his moral fabric better than me eh


I never said that.
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#143 Discogirl17

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:19 PM

Stop fighting guys, you are moderators for goodness sake. Set a good example.
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#144 bred

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:23 PM

Calm down, I'm just ironing out a bit of confusion.
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#145 Discogirl17

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:27 PM

I was talking to both of you but ok fine then Dave stop it, I sense the anger
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#146 ermd

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:32 PM

QUOTE(Dave @ May 14 2005, 01:57 PM)
Blair didnt misled anyone he was telling people the facts as me was told them. What would anyother leader have done. As you go into school and you see new computers and new desks and new systems to increase late coming and increase results they are all Labour policys in action. The reason the NHS is still free at point of use is because of Labour. The economy in UK as a whole is strong. It was Blair that gave us a devolved government even after we voted against it the first time around.

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He misled his cabinet. He misled the country. He had already decided some 8 months prior that he would go to war whether it was legal or not. He said Britain would "inevitably" back the war.

Can't say I have seen a new desk in my whole time at Ardrossan Academy. The paint is peeling from the walls (not an exaggeration). And why, might I ask, would Blair have introduced a system to increase latecoming? What systems do you refer to for improving grades? League tables? Head teachers denounce them.

The NHS would have been free at point of use even if the Tories got in. That is a weak argument. The NHS is stressing and straining under new Labour's target figures. It sould be run to provide a high quality service, not be run to save costs wherever possible.

The economy itself has been pretty stable under New Labour - but at what cost? The wealth gap has widened, over 1 million manufacturing jobs have gone, average take home pay has fallen.

And the devolved government. The only good thing that has come out of that was abolition of scottish top-up fees. A policy that Tony and his cronies opposed.

#147 Discogirl17

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 02:34 PM

Politics arguements have a tendancy to get nasty, the same with science arguements. I'm staying out of this.
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#148 Moral Fabric

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 09:37 PM

What Blair was told, was what he told us, And I'm not just some random guy that comes on to slag off people!!! check back, ermdev started on me first, when i made my arguemetn about capitlism and socialism in general,... now its became a dispute on whether or not Blair is a competant leader or not....
My point was that ermdev was saying other peoples ie my arguement was only my opinion, when blatantly so is his....
Dave and me are on a par i reckon, so far I agree with most of what he has said.
p.s. Blair Pwns biggrin.gif

Later

#149 Dave

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 10:03 PM

No the torys would have privatised more of the NHs and made an increasing number of procedures payable

The fact you brought up "top up fees" implies you are just repeating the media and the SSP in this country we dont pay for fees so top up fees were never considered. In england students are required to pay tuition fees and the gov are saying that to solve the problem that uni's have no money then resource intensive courses would have additional charges placed on students. Actually it does make good sense really

If there is no money in your school i dont understand why because i happen to know people in St Micheals Academy and money is pouring in there and they are flatting the place soon

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#150 Moral Fabric

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 10:38 PM

QUOTE(Dave @ May 14 2005, 11:03 PM)
No the torys would have privatised more of the NHs and made an increasing number of procedures payable

The fact you brought up "top up  fees" implies you are just repeating the media and the SSP in this country we dont pay for fees so top up fees were never considered. In england students are required to pay tuition fees and the gov are saying that to solve the problem that uni's have no money then resource intensive courses would have additional charges placed on students. Actually it does make good sense really

If there is no money in your school i dont understand why because i happen to know people in St Micheals Academy and money is pouring in there and they are flatting the place soon

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no offence, but i dont follow you tongue.gif lol

#151 Dave

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Posted 14 May 2005 - 11:51 PM

Meh dont know/cant be bothered trying to explain it. Too tired for that

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#152 Discogirl17

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Posted 15 May 2005 - 10:51 AM

Yawn, I'm quickly getting very bored of this topic
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#153 ermd

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Posted 15 May 2005 - 11:23 AM

QUOTE(Dave @ May 14 2005, 10:03 PM)

If there is no money in your school i dont understand why because i happen to know people in St Micheals Academy and money is pouring in there and they are flatting the place soon

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That is why there is little money. All of our education budget has gone onto the amalgamation of St Michael's and St. Andrew's into one. And why do they say they are doing it? "To run a more efficient service". So they seem to see it as being important to save money rather than run a higher quality service?

And Moral Fabric, I note you still haven't found one post of mine which seemed to just be fabricated opinion. tongue.gif

On top-up fees - wrong word choice on my part. They weren't "abolished", but they would have been introduced if it weren't for the Liberal bill which removed the possibility of any fees. And don't try to tell me the media is biased towards the left in this country. Murdoch owns most of it - and he is a Blair man.

The only way the Tories could possibly have further privatised would be full privatisation! Labour's PPPs are a waste of taxpayer's money which could be better invested directly into the health service. Fewer clipboard carriers, more doctors!

And finally, Blair did not tell us what he was told. He said the secretary general's advice was unequivocal. Not what it seemed from the leaked documents. The initial report demanded a second UN resolution, it said there were serious concerns over the legality without one. Yet for the report Blair presented to parliament, none of this was included. So, what made the secreatry general change his tone so quickly? And why did Geoff Hoon, the defence secretary, initally deny having seen the first report? Did he too have concerns over the legality but wanted to proceed anyway?

I'm astounded that there are still people who think the war was justified. On what grounds?

#154 Moral Fabric

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Posted 16 May 2005 - 09:34 AM

QUOTE(Discogirl17 @ May 15 2005, 11:51 AM)
Yawn, I'm quickly getting very bored of this topic

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me too

#155 Dave

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Posted 16 May 2005 - 09:55 AM

The council isnt spending any money on joining the schools together as its PPP so a company will build the school not the public purse

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#156 coca

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Posted 16 May 2005 - 02:47 PM

QUOTE(Moral Fabric @ May 16 2005, 10:34 AM)
QUOTE(Discogirl17 @ May 15 2005, 11:51 AM)
Yawn, I'm quickly getting very bored of this topic

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me too

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Yep, me too!

<MrBob> I hate Uni. At least in film studies we get to talk about Fight Club.
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#157 Discogirl17

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 10:52 PM

What did I tell you, ssshhhh I'm bored of this topic now, I'd close it if I had the power
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#158 bred

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Posted 18 May 2005 - 09:10 AM

Don't read the thread if it bores you so much!
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#159 Dave

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Posted 18 May 2005 - 09:53 AM

seriously closing threads is so...so Tory (course Ermdev would say its so Blairism) tongue.gif

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#160 ermd

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Posted 18 May 2005 - 11:10 AM

Exactly tongue.gif. You go to a thesaurus in 10 years or so and each will be listed as a synonym of the other biggrin.gif.

Blairism (syn) - Tory, neo-liberalism, Thatcherism, war-mongering, American-smooching.

(aton.) - Labour Party.





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